How to financially survive a divorce

This audio transcript is the transcription of the

Money Clinic

podcast episode:

‘How to financially survive a divorce'

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Tina

It was financially draining, emotionally draining and mentally draining for all involved. It broke me, which I can't deny. It has made me a stronger person, I believe.

Claer Barrett

That's Tina. She's 54, has two children in their late teens, and over the past couple of years, she has gone through something that has changed her life in many ways and cost her a lot of money: divorce.

Tina

Each cost approximately PS40,000. They did send us an annual bill at each year's end. It was approximately 20,000 per year.

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Claer Barrett

Welcome to Money Clinic, a weekly podcast by the Financial Times that discusses personal finance and investing. Claer Barrett is the FT's consumer editor.

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Today's episode shows that divorce inquiries peak in the first months of a new calendar year. We thought we would offer some guidance to anyone who is contemplating this difficult step. It can be hard to separate from someone you are legally bound to and may share a property. It cost Tina thousands of pounds, as you may have heard. Is that not normal? How on earth could it have gotten to this point? Here I am with Brett Frankle, a divorce lawyer from the law firm Withers. Hi, Brett.

Brett Frankle

Hi.

Claer Barrett

Tamsin Caine (a financial planner based in Manchester) is joining us. Hello to you.

Tamsin Caine

Hi, Claer.

Claer Barrett

So, I will be analyzing Tamsin's and Brett's experiences in separating the emotional from the financial when it comes down to negotiating a settlement for a divorce. We will also discuss the costs of divorcing, including legal fees, how to manage them, how to adjust to being a single person and how to make the process of dividing the assets with your ex-partner as painless as possible. We'll also discuss how to separate pensions, when it is best to leave the family home, and when it is best to call a professional for advice. A couple Money Clinic listeners will share their stories about divorce and the challenges they faced.

First, let's get back to Tina. She spent PS40,000 on two years of divorce proceedings, and she finally got her divorce in February last year. Persis Love was the one to tell about it.

Tina

We were unable to communicate right from the early days, unfortunately. We did consider using a mediator, but that was a difficult process. We couldn't come to an agreement on that. So in the end, it was only communication via each of the solicitors and because of that, it just meant that everything was done on the legal side rather than face to face.

Persis Love

So when you say legal fees, is that kind of consultations? What does that consist of? What was that money going towards?

Tina

The idea was that that was for letters. It was for emails. I mean, I think they charged £20 for an email going one way and £20 for a response. But send, you know, send half a dozen emails and half of them as responses and you've already got a substantial amount added to your monthly bill. There was all sorts of bits and bobs that they had to do. Any telephone matters, anything to do with the properties, to do with the vehicles that we both had in our possession, to do with pensions. There was just so many things that, you know, when added up, that's why it was totalling over £1,000 a month.

Persis Love

Was there any other option available to you in such a situation? There are many ways to get divorced like this, but this is the most cost-effective way.

Tina

No, basically, if I couldn't afford to pay, then the suggestion was that I'd have to go ahead without legal representation. But as far as they were concerned, they knew that I could afford it. So even though I personally felt it was such a struggle, they didn't ever see it as a struggle because of what money they knew I would be entitled to and what money I already had in savings.

Persis Love

Did you know how much it would cost?

Tina

Initial contact with them resulted in a quote of PS500. Evidently, I have never been divorced before. I was unsure how long it would take. I assumed that we would meet and then, with everything, we'd be able to agree to divorce. 50-50 of everything is yours. It would have been much easier to tell me that it was a PS500 starting block. However, most divorces with private businesses, pensions, or other issues could cost as high as PS40,000.

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Claer Barrett

Well, that was Tina there telling us about the experiences of her divorce. And she says, you only really find out about this when it happens to you. It's not something we would wish to experience twice in our lives. But Tamsin, as a financial planner who works with people who are going through a divorce, I mean, these kinds of fees, is £40,000 a common amount to spend on a divorce?

Tamsin Caine

Probably, yes. It's absolutely heartbreaking listening to Tina, isn't it? And yeah, the fees can certainly rack up. And 40,000, um, actually isn't that unusual, unfortunately.

Claer Barrett

Brett, as a divorce attorney, what did Tina think of the situation? Some of her comments made you feel uncomfortable.

Brett Frankle

That's what I did. It was a bit uncomfortable for me to listen to. Clients should have a clear understanding of the process as well as the potential costs. It is disappointing to hear the profession tell me that PS500 will cost $500. It is important to remember that it is not always possible to provide fixed costs or views at the outset.

Claer Barrett

Could you walk me through the divorce process and the different costs that rack up at different stages? Now, Tina mentioned getting a mediator at the beginning, which would have avoided the need, as you say, for an acrimonious battle between solicitors. It wasn't something that they went through with in the end. But Brett, would you say that's the first step that somebody who's considering a divorce should take?

Brett Frankle

The divorce process is easy and can be done online. It costs PS593. It costs PS593. You simply need to tick the box that you want a divorce. Divorce is often very simple. The division of assets is often what leads to costs. Parties are required to think about mediation before they begin any legal proceedings. Often, cases can be resolved through mediation or other forms of amicable resolution.

Claer Barrett

Tamsin, can you tell us about mediation and the clients you advise on a daily base?

Tamsin Caine

It can also be used to resolve financial problems. It can also be used to resolve issues related to children. In certain instances, such as when I work with mediation clients, I may be called a financial neutral.

Claer Barrett

Mm-hmm.

Tamsin Caine

So that would be where I joined the mediation and worked to provide information to both parties so that they're both getting the same information. Another way that I work with clients in mediation is where there is perhaps a, I'm gonna call it a power imbalance. So where one party is financially much more used to dealing with money and perhaps more financially educated or just financially capable than the other, which makes negotiations very difficult and can be very imbalanced. So I might work with the less financially educated party to bring them up so that they feel confident to enter the negotiations and provide their side of the argument without being overpowered.

Claer Barrett

If you find yourself in a situation where money is tight and you are worried about not having enough money to pay the legal fees of divorcing and all the associated costs, you aren't alone. Brett, what can you do?

Brett Frankle

You don't need to hire a lawyer. You can choose to work with a lawyer however you like. People often have lawyers to help them with their questions. It is also true that many cases don't see lawyers. Many people can resolve their issues themselves. There are many websites that provide information. The Family Justice Council guidance and the Resolution website are just two examples. They also have a lot of useful details on how to get a divorce. There are also many great charities that offer advice and help to citizens.

Claer Barrett

Wow, we will put links to all of those in the show notes for today's episode. But now let's hear from another Money Clinic listener who's going by the name of Jane. She has an American accent, but her and her ex live in the UK, so they got divorced under the UK family law. She also spoke to our producer, Persis Love, and as was the case for Tina, Jane found that divorce proceedings were far more complicated than she'd anticipated.

Jane

We discovered that divorce is made up of three elements. Your legal status. If you file for divorce, then you are legally divorcing. Separately, if you have minor children, both parties must come to an agreement on how to care for them. The other, more difficult area was settling on a financial split. That's the source of all our problems. It's been very difficult, slow-going, and costly. It takes so long.

Persis Love

What were the assets actually being disputed within the financial order? How were you going to divide them up?

Jane

It was easy for me because I was focusing on the equity of the house and our pensions. My ex had a huge career hit during my children's earliest years, so the pensions were skewed heavily in her favor. I started by saying that I needed a bit more equity than 50-50 to be able to afford a place to live with my children. The counter-offer was, "That's fine." You could have a little more, but I won't share any of my pension with anyone. We have now reached a deadlock in our negotiations.

Persis Love

So, while you were at a standstill, I mean, how was it? What financial position were you in?

Jane

So in my situation, for example, my ex, he moved out. So he decided that he wasn't going to contribute towards the joint mortgage or the utilities or the council tax in the family home because he had moved out. And I discovered, to my horror really, that there was nothing I could really do about it, because the court can't order both parties to pay towards the joint mortgage. They wouldn't even know what sort of contribution to order to me. But apparently this isn't a thing, you can't make the other side pay.

Persis Love

It sounds like you have reached a deadlock. But can you tell me why your ex didn't want to sign the new mortgage?

Jane

It was all about trying to get me to settle the financial proceedings as soon as possible. My view was that the settlement offer I was offered was extremely, very unfavorable to me. It just didn't make any sense.

Persis Love

Now, Jane, obviously you're coming to the end of your divorce proceedings, but thinking back to a couple of years ago when you were starting out, what sort of questions would you have had back then that we should ask our experts on the podcast now?

Jane

I would be interested in knowing the practical and important financial steps I should take to ask my partner for a separation.

Persis Love

And anything else?

Jane

Would you know of any legal process that would allow both spouses to jointly mortgage a loan? This could be done within or without family law. If your ex-partner isn't cooperating, moral obligation is inapplicable.

Claer Barrett

Well, we heard from Jane there about the troubles that she's been going through, trying to separate from her partner financially. Brett, does this kind of thing sound familiar to you? Are these sorts of disputes around the family home part and parcel of your everyday work as a divorce lawyer?

Brett Frankle

They are, to a certain extent. It is very common for people to use their financial advantage to their benefit.

Claer Barrett

These are the kinds of disputes in which one partner says, "Well, you can still live with your family, but I have to pay my own expenses so that I don't have to pay the mortgage." This is a common scenario?

Brett Frankle

One of the questions that was asked was whether there is a legal route to enforce payments. And the short answer is there is. I'm surprised that it hadn't been raised before. The courts are very clear that you shouldn't be placing financial pressure on your spouse at a time when you're trying to negotiate an overall financial settlement. So there is the option for what we call interim maintenance. There's the option for legal services provision in order to help pay for legal fees. The courts are very clear that that sort of approach is not to be tolerated. Obviously, I can't comment on each individual case and affordability, but it is something that people should understand — that they can't bully their spouse into doing a deal by stripping away money that's needed.

Claer Barrett

Let's now talk about how we get to that financial settlement. Brett, what assets are included in the financial settlement? What information must each party disclose?

Bre